Preemptive Postapocalypticism's topics - tribe.net

Backup/Secondary weapons

Horse — Sat, 05 Jul 2008 06:05:18 GMT

Armageddon has come and gone. You've lost 60 pounds, two fingers and half your teeth, but somehow you survived. The collapse is total -- there is no electricity, no running water, no gasoline, no commerce, no law, no government whatsoever. Worse yet, the ammo is all long gone, burned up in running firefights and the daily survival grind. The Mitches now rule the world, while you run around the ruins every day in your soggy underwear, barefoot, hungry, dodging the Freaks and cooking cats over greenwood fires. What backup weapons did you stash and learn to use before TSHTF, back when you had a job and a bank account and ate green eggs and SPAM for breakfast every morning? What weapons do you wish you had bought, or learned to use? What CQB weapons have you had to make since Armageddon, because you freakishly only invested in your 5 Main Battle rifles and ten thousand rounds of penetrator ammo back when you had it all? What do you hunt with? What do you fight COOL ICE and his ICE-cold minions with? Is it strong enough to crack their ICE?

I prefer Mora knives and tomahawks, though the Russian fighting shovel sold by Cold Steel beats both.

posted in Preemptive Postapocalypticism - 25 replies

A bat-cave on a bat-guano budget

A Thousand Good Intentions — Thu, 03 Jul 2008 00:08:20 GMT

Ballistic resistance

Radio communications/scanning

Off-grid power

NBC resistance

Water procurement

What are some cheap tricks to get these advantages in a 'poor mans's james bond' sort of way? Let's say you don't care one bit about aesthetics, how would you get it done for dirt cheap? On the other hand, let's say you live full-time in your intended 'retreat locale' and DO care about aesthetics, but still want to stretch that budget as far as you can?

How does McGuyver make his house (or retreat) 'functionally' as cool as James Bond's?

posted in Preemptive Postapocalypticism - 22 replies

How will you lift your spirits after TSHTF?

Horse — Fri, 27 Jun 2008 00:46:20 GMT

I will find great solace in doing real work that tangibly affects myself and those around me by keeping us alive.

posted in Preemptive Postapocalypticism - 19 replies

Call for a new moderator

bad-dawg — Thu, 03 Jul 2008 23:15:01 GMT

Thousand has proven himself not to be adult enough to be a moderator. His insistence that spreading hate is ok, his series of abusive attacks on my character, and his banning me 4 times after I spoke out against his hate and name calling are ample evidence of his instability and inability to think clearly. I am not the only one he has done tis to, Btw, there are quite a few members that have contacted me to say they were abused this way too.

I formally request that the tribe make their opinions clear. And no, I don't want to be the moderator, I know I am too "hot headed".
If you would like to read the posts in question, please do. It's mostly in the politics before EOW, 2nd amendment, and in the Thousand Banned me threads.

posted in Preemptive Postapocalypticism - 26 replies

How fast it can all go wrong

Brent — Fri, 27 Jun 2008 21:34:21 GMT

Last week a pretty good hail storm missed our house by about 4 miles. It was one that pummelled garden's to the ground. We dodged the bullet on that one. That night, some cat sqeezed through the crack at the top of the gate and killed 21 new starter chic's. Killed them for the joy of killing.

That got me thinking that it only take's one run of bad luck to put a family in a hurting if they didnt have other mean's to get groceries. A good hail storm and a predatory animal can mess up your whole year.

posted in Preemptive Postapocalypticism - 35 replies

Thousand banned me...

bad-dawg — Sun, 29 Jun 2008 04:50:06 GMT

Talk about a bad attitude... start a thread on hate and ban me for responding?

cowardly...

posted in Preemptive Postapocalypticism - 30 replies

Fresh Slate

A Thousand Good Intentions — Wed, 02 Jul 2008 23:08:20 GMT

I was just poking around on the net here, and came across a neat little nugget, a very simple quote:

''Trust is more important than skills''

How true. I'd rather be in a cooperative, helpful, trustworthy-to-the-end group of average-skilled, yet determined and positive individuals than a team of bitching, fighting, each-man-for-himself conglomerate of agricultural experts, mechanical engineers, combat veterans and experienced physicians.

I dunno. Maybe I'm just getting burnt out on all this bickering. It was fun banter until some people started taking it all personal. I love a good debate, and I enjoy intellectual argument, but I don't really go in for drama and bitter fights with personal agendas. Can we safely say that we've all gotten some aggression out of our collective systems and are ready to use this fine little tribe for the good and constructive purpose for which it was intended?

posted in Preemptive Postapocalypticism - 12 replies

politics before eow

Brent — Sat, 21 Jun 2008 03:53:21 GMT

Here's a thread that shouldve been here a long time ago. This is where you can post the contraversial issues so Americans that dont want to read it dont have to. Now while we're reading messages on thread's that relate to the actually meaning of the group, offensive thing's wont jump out at you.

Thank you,

So, If you dont like bush, mccain, obama, pelosi, preacher's, liberal's, conservatives, limbaugh, soros, big oil, big corn, big walmart, V-8 engines, fetuses, edison light bulbs, hunting, fishing, eating meat or tofu, fertilizing with horse shit or people shit. ddt, ammonia nitrates, fags, straights, spotted owls, horse racing, cramming shit covered cattle in truck's, slaughter houses, population growth, global warming, guns, knives, freedom and liberty, communism, socialism, capitalism, black people, white people, oriental's, mexicans, indians, christians, atheists, dope, big pharmacy, wars or whatever. Post it here.

WARNING- people of different custom's, race or sex may find the following messages offensive. If you do not want to be offended then exit now by clicking the back button on the upper left hand screen.

posted in Preemptive Postapocalypticism - 90 replies

politics after eow

matt — Thu, 26 Jun 2008 03:10:16 GMT

Now just tell me...

How in an EOW situation would all you people get along if you had to depend on one another. Would there be laws outlawing bickering? Homosexuality? Abortion? Christian moral supremo-ism? etc. etc. etc.

Is is possible for y'all to HATE these things about each other and still survive together if forced to? Or would the internal bickering get in the way of defenses and provisions leaving a gaping hole for Mitch to come waltzing right in and take what little is left.

Is there an answer with how to deal with whoever is left? I would like to point out that just holing up in your house with your immediate family is not a feasible response considering that eventually some breeding must take place. If your sons and daughters, who are brothers and sisters, are forced to mate, a whole slew of little Mitch kids will be running the show eventually. ha ha j/k

Really though, nonindustrial societies usually collapse due to either exceeding the lands carrying capacity, or by not having enough people to maintain homeostasis. In an EOW situation, you will be very likely faced with dealing with people that you HATE. Or like, and do things you HATE. How is that dealt with? Is there a death penalty? Is there ostracism, punishment, exile? And what are the criterion for these punishments to be instilled?

posted in Preemptive Postapocalypticism - 33 replies

2nd amendment and the supreme court: Yet more Politics...

bad-dawg — Fri, 27 Jun 2008 01:31:38 GMT

I really have to say folks, I was seriously worried about the rightwing stacking of the supreme court that has happened during the bush administration, but I was seriously surprised when 2 of the last three rulings went the way they did.

1. Exxon Valdez. Bad bad BAD ruling. They just seriously screwed a lot of working folks in Prince William Sound and Exxon got away with a slap on the wrist.

2. No death penalty for child rapists: As much as they may deserve it, and the guy in this particular case especially so(He raped his own 8 year old daughter), It's not our right to kill people(except in defense of ourselves or family) because we(humans) are fallible. And if we kill somebody and then find out they didn't do it... my bad just doesn't cut it...

3. Gun ban in DC: I was really surprised they even touched it in the first place, I expected it to go down unread... Instead, it was brought out, discussed very intelligently and Holy crap! They ruled against it, thereby making a groundbreaking precedent by stating it is perfectly fine for any upstanding citizen to have guns in their possession for defense! GREAT JOB!!! That is a huge milestone and we are not going to have to worry about the Government trying to take our guns away!!!

I am pretty happy about that 3rd one... No officer, you CANNOT take my Colt from me!!!

posted in Preemptive Postapocalypticism - 10 replies

Shaving after TEOTWAWKI

A Thousand Good Intentions — Sat, 31 May 2008 01:37:22 GMT

Trivial compared to so many other things. Shaving? could we be any more VAIN?

Try getting a good airtight seal on that gasmask with your grizly-adams. Then tell me about vain.

And that really bad cut on your family member's scalp? The one they got from flying debris in that storm six months after the infrastructure collapsed? you're worried it might get infected, but you can't get past that full head of hair to bandage, suture, and properly treat it.

And vain as it might seem, your wife just can't get used to the idea of letting her body go all hairy. And you don't like the fire-hazard attached to your face every time you try to kindle the stove.

Anyone know the art of the straight edge and strop? how do you make shaving cream?

How about other means of managing hair? I'm all ears.

posted in Preemptive Postapocalypticism - 43 replies

Anyone from Maryland?

NightWolf77 — Sat, 28 Jun 2008 13:28:03 GMT

Just wondering if anyone in this tribe is from Maryland?

posted in Preemptive Postapocalypticism - 9 replies

murder's in AZ?

Brent — Sat, 28 Jun 2008 02:42:38 GMT

I saw a new's report that some people in Arizona were killed by possibly some soldier's in the mexican military.

Have any of you Arizona tribe member's heard anything about it?

posted in Preemptive Postapocalypticism - 0 replies

What do you do with dead zombies?

Horse — Mon, 23 Jun 2008 02:31:49 GMT

We've been trapped in this derelict Taco Hell fast food joint for 3 weeks now, and I've begun wiping my ass with my left hand and eating with my right. That just came naturally, after we ran out of TP about a week ago. Luckily, we still have plenty of canned food, H20 and ammo for our Big Guns. But that's all beside the point. The problem we're having is not with braining the zombies that crash through the boarded-up windows, it's what to do with them once we brain them. We've stacked them 8-high in front of the doors, and piled them up on the roof, but now the ceiling is bowed. We tried to burn some in the dumpster, but they wouldn't catch fire. In case you don't know it, dead zombies smell REALLY bad and their slippery red brains get everywhere. I think we can survive this EOTW scenario, if only we can figure out how to dispose of all these dead zombies, and all their soon-to-be-dead undead friends who will soon have their brains smashed in.

posted in Preemptive Postapocalypticism - 25 replies

Will you be among the most prosperous?

Kate — Sun, 08 Jun 2008 21:57:26 GMT

Tomorrows "wealthiest" people will be those who are rich in mind, body, and spirit. I fully honor the previous thread because knowing who will and how to control material wealth will be important and will surely shift.

I agree that it is clear the basics--food, shelter, and clean water are, well, basic. Without them no one will live, let alone prosper. However, we're discussing prospering here. We already have a wealth of ideas. Doing something about it is an individual thing. Act on what you are thinking. Achieving security is a community thing. We will prosper together in groups.

I will need people around me who are the protectors, and hunters/scavengers. I want around me musicians, fabricators, weavers, makers of clothing, story tellers, excellent cooks, a dowser. Visualize someone strumming the guitar, drumming softly, while others are plying a needle, or packing ammunition, near by. Sounds, aromas, useful objects, tools, the love of friends and family--these will enrich my life.

I admit an aversion to the war-like scenarios. Yet, I have learned to shoot a gun, draw a bow. I'm not much of a gardener either, but I pay attention and learn what I can. These skills will be practical. I am not young, and not much of a story teller, but I am a healer.

Thank you, ATGI for your thumbs up and the advise to build a reputation not based on "woo-woo" trappings but on results, and the practical application of herbs, and "surgical" skills. I am an 'old nurse'--one taught just when the profession was beginning to be called a 'profession' and just when the schools were beginning to be called schools rather than 'training.' Since I never did fall into seeing energy medicine as something magical, but rather something physical that we are beginning to recognize and understand, I feel prepared to advance my practice and build a good reputation. By gathering good people around me, like some who have posted here, I will be among the "wealthiest."

How do you see your particular skill fitting into a prosperous and healthy group of people?

posted in Preemptive Postapocalypticism - 110 replies

what do you do when i come to your house?

Mitch — Sun, 02 Mar 2008 05:50:39 GMT

the world has ended, a big plague has killed 9 out of ten families, you are the only family left on your block. you have food, you are buttoned up in your house at night, and me and my friend come. how do you detect me if there is no electricity to run your alarm or lights?

posted in Preemptive Postapocalypticism - 67 replies

Oil crop info

sharkgoddess — Sun, 01 Jun 2008 17:41:13 GMT

Thought you guys might find this interesting:

http://journeytoforever.org/biodiesel_yield.html#ascend

posted in Preemptive Postapocalypticism - 33 replies

Collective Conscience

Tinkles — Thu, 12 Jun 2008 05:07:24 GMT

Is it just me, or is the whole world starting to lean toward preparedness for WTSHTF at an unholy rate? It seems like every other website is about self reliance, how effed up the government is, 2012, global warming, or some other problem or solution to do with our declining society.

I've always thought in survival mode, but it seems like more people are starting to think this way. Do you think that this could be a "self fulfilling prophecy," with all these people thinking along these lines? It could be harmful to resonate on that vibe. (I know that sounded hippie-ish, so what.)

I also wonder if it's because "THE SUPER POWER AMERICA" is finally starting to become aware of what's going on with our government, feeling our wallets getting lighter, and of course, terrorism, lol. Maybe the rest of the world senses Americans desperation for a change, and that scares them, because if we're hurting they might not be far behind, and maybe even worse off.

posted in Preemptive Postapocalypticism - 17 replies

Maggots: the other white meat

A Thousand Good Intentions — Wed, 11 Jun 2008 06:00:21 GMT

Another benefit of chickens, which many people wouldn't consider: in a famine/drought/major crisis.... you might have better uses for your last bucket of precious grain, that throwing it to the chickens....

When you hunt or come across some roadkill, keep the offal (kidneys, liver, lungs) in a bucket and leave it out to go bad. Pretty soon you will have an abundant supply of maggots. Rinse the offal occasionally to glean off a harvest of maggots, then put it back in the bucket. As far as a chicken is concerned, maggots are good as mealworms, which they think are pretty good. You can raise chickens their whole life on maggots, if you had to.

Can't really say the same for rabbits, goats, or anything else you might want to raise for food. Gross to think of, and definitely a last-ditch, but it's a last-ditch that's there for you if you need it.

Maggots are also amazing little critters for dealing with necrotic tissue (gangrene) in fact, to this very day there really isn't anything in medicine that is quite so conservative towards living flesh while still thorough with infected/dead flesh in a necrotic wound. Many people's lives have been accidentally saved by maggots. Some people have died from infectious disease after the maggots were removed from their wounds.

Food for thought... and for chickens.

posted in Preemptive Postapocalypticism - 19 replies

Who's the most grizzled?

Brent — Wed, 11 Jun 2008 04:52:49 GMT

I dont trust bank's, I keep my earnings hid in the septic tank. I wipe my butt with stinging nettles and if I have problem with dingle berries I pour gun powder on the a-hole and strike a match. I shave the sack with a double edge ax but I just rip my beard out. If I can stirr the coffee without bending the spoon, it's not strong enough. I add dirt to my stew for a little extra flavor and my sheep loves my cooking. That's why she stayed with me so long. I never where shoes and this gunny sack is the smoothest underwear I've ever wore.

now that's grizzled

posted in Preemptive Postapocalypticism - 19 replies

Wheat prices

A Thousand Good Intentions — Tue, 10 Jun 2008 07:21:55 GMT

Wallyworld is really getting into this whole 'emergency preparedness' wave. They sell food storage rack systems, water tanks, pumps, 72-hour kits by the ton...

But lately I'm seeing pallets stacked with 25lb bags of wheat... and the prices are going... down? from 13.5 bucks a bag to 11 bucks... and hopefully, still falling. finally.

I kinda predicted about a month ago, that this 'food crisis' would peak out during the summer, and the insane demand it generated (here and exports) would prompt farmers to some drastic crop switches, and we'd have a temporary glut later on in the harvest. But could it be this soon?

What do you guys see in the future of the food market? What would you prompt your fellow preparers to save up for, when to buy and what?

And will this temporary lull signify the end of a food scare, or set the stage for a complacent society that will laugh at the next scare, and make fertile ground for a more disastrous impact in the future?

posted in Preemptive Postapocalypticism - 20 replies

Tomorrow's wealthiest people

A Thousand Good Intentions — Mon, 02 Jun 2008 05:20:40 GMT

We have our lawyers and our stock brokers today. Publicity agents, public relations directors, motivational speakers.... Many people have figured out ways of creating their ideal ammount of wealth based on today's rules and opportunities of society.

What about tomorrow? Who will be the smartly-positioned one to catch all the wealth that falls when it collapses?

During the French Revolution, there was a sudden social role-reversal, aristocrats trading fine furniture and jewelry for staples like bread, medicine, or equipment repairs. The poor, the lowly peasants who lived close to the earth and under their means, were not negatively affected by the essential collapse of their society. In fact, many profited from it greatly, and were able to maneuver themselves and their families into a new kind of wealth leverage, after a long history of generations of subsistent peasantry.

So what would be some trades to equip yourself for and master now, which might make fun hobbies, side-incomes or even main incomes, and which same things would become priceless skills in the future?

Off the top of my head, I think of Ammunition reloading, and production of black powder, (or if you're a chemist, make some smokeless powder). Be the local bullet cobbler. People would pay a week's worth of groceries for five good hunting bullets.

Someone who can produce oil. As Paige mentioned in another thread. Cooking oil, medicinal oil, machine lubrication.

What are some valuable trades you could learn or think you should learn? Something you'd have a corner-market on if you mastered the trade today. Something that less than one in a thousand people knows how to do or could do... Something that would make you the wealthiest, most securely protected and in-demand kid on your block.

posted in Preemptive Postapocalypticism - 57 replies

Who will be accepted in community ?

Jim — Tue, 10 Jun 2008 17:43:05 GMT

We can all list our various skills and attributes. We can each make a case for being accepted into community. But, if you walk up to the gate of a community, how do you talk your way in ? (Which is also to say, how does someone else talk their way into your community.)

I believe that there are just four ways to "get into" an established group.

1). Before EOW, you are already friends with and a member of an EOW community/tribe/band. This means establishing a group right now, ..something few are doing. You need to act now, for this to work.

2). You have a variety of skills, trades, knowledge that a community needs. Among the skills of interest to a group might be live fire military experience, herbalist, veterinary, ER doctor, organic gardener. If you walk up to the gate and say you have good accounting skills, or you're a good cook, babysitter or musician, probably the group doesn't need that so much. ..A funny thing though, even with such skills as blacksmith, you may not be needed. Most any really functioning community will already have metal workers. --Be truly necessary.

3). You have a good supply of appropriate books, or tools, or weapons, or heritage seeds, you are probably needed. But, if you show up at their door, with everything in hand, the community just might decide to "share" your goods with you, without taking you in. You probably need to hide most of what you have, and only take some of your goods with you, to buy your way in, with the promise of more if you become a premanent member. ...There's a risk though. They might consider coersing you until you show them your stash. A few days of "over the hill", quiet observing of the community might help you determine whether to risk approaching them.

4). You can try to buy your way in by the offer of sex. ..This would likely lead to a very short term offer of accomodation. It's also a not a very likely to be accepted offer from most men. And a very unsatisfactory offer and acceptance for most women. This is by far the worst way to get into a community.

---So how do you "get in" ? Which one of these four would you use to get into their community ? Or which would you accept from someone to join your community ?

..Or is there another method to make yourself a valuable commodity ?

posted in Preemptive Postapocalypticism - 1 reply

Wood Gasification

Horse — Mon, 02 Jun 2008 03:52:44 GMT

Wood gasification sounds like one of the coolest fuel technologies out there. You can use it to run a modified internal combustion engine. Basically, you heat wood or organic matter, releasing combustible gases which are used to fuel the engine. The wood turns to charcoal in the process.

Here are some links:

http://images.google.com/imgres?imgurl=http://strangevehicles.greyfalcon.us/Pictures/hol1.jpg&imgrefurl=http://strangevehicles.greyfalcon.us/HOLZBRENNER%2520VOLKSWAGENS.htm&h=265&w=400&sz=33&hl=en&start=4&um=1&tbnid=tqEaPCWM4nRqZM:&tbnh=82&tbnw=124&prev=/images%3Fq%3Dwood%2Bgasification%2BVW%26um%3D1%26hl%3Den%26client%3Dfirefox-a%26rls%3Dorg.mozilla:en-US:official%26sa%3DN

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Wood_gas_generator

posted in Preemptive Postapocalypticism - 10 replies

Gun porn - new firearms technologies

Horse — Mon, 02 Jun 2008 03:41:58 GMT

I hope this posting is appropriate for this tribe. I posted something recently at the Survival Firearms tribe and never got any response, so I thought maybe this would be a better venue. I'm just throwing out some links to new firearms technologies, to see what you folks have to say on the subject.

There's the AA12 Automatic Shotgun: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hhstuvzMiB0

There's MetalStorm: http://www.metalstorm.com/

There's the KRISS Super V XSMG System .45 ACP Submachine Gun: http://hamptonroads.com/node/343981

There's the Corner Shot: http://www.israeli-weapons.com/weapons/small_arms/corner_shot/Corner_Shot.htm

There's the Dread Weapon System: http://www.defensereview.com/article526.html

And undoubtedly there are more.

I happen to think that the AA12 and various MetalStorm technologies are going to be heavily used some day. The Dread is an intriguing concept, but the energy required to run it, plus the fact that the round projectiles will curve in flight, seem like major limitations.

Fire when ready.

posted in Preemptive Postapocalypticism - 1 reply

Salt

Tinkles — Tue, 27 May 2008 21:58:40 GMT

How, (other than the ocean,) does one acquire salt in the wild? Being a necessity of life, and all. I know that you can derive salt from blood, but where do the animals get their salt intake requirements? I would even hate to be without it when you're trying to just make food taste better.

posted in Preemptive Postapocalypticism - 15 replies

Can't find that thread

Adam — Thu, 29 May 2008 23:24:46 GMT

Curtiss posted a thread about being ruthless. I can;t find it anywhere. Did he delete it and quit the tribe? Was it this tribe?

posted in Preemptive Postapocalypticism - 4 replies

Time: How to Survive a Disaster

Artistpriestess — Sat, 31 May 2008 17:04:25 GMT

(just posted this on the Survivalist Tribe and thought you all might be interested)
This article is long (four pages), but I found it very helpful in understanding human behavior during a disaster . . .

http://www.time.com/time/magazine/article/0,9171,1810315,00.html?xid=rss-topstories

Below are some of my personal experiences . . .
Anam Cara, Bonnie

I remember, 20 years ago, reading about a little girl, Laura Small, that was attacked by a mountain lion in Laguna Hills, CA . . . what I remember was that her mother was paralyzed, screaming, until a hunter came along and beat the lion off the girl . . . I beleive the girl lost an eye and had head damage, but did survive . . . this made a lasting impression on me, and how I would act in an emergency situation, and I continue to try to prepare myself for possible situations . . .

When I was young I thought it would be cool to survive a natural disaster . . . then, I was working in Santa Cruz during the 1989 Loma Prieta earthquake (6.9-7.1) . . . there were many examples of human error . . . I was the 1st person out of my building when the shaking stopped, made sure that my immediate colleagues were Ok and then said "I'm out of here" . . . the next shock was when I put my car radio on scan to find a news report, but there were no broadcasts, it just kept going round and round . . . when it did finally kick in, hours later, I was stuck on a bridge in traffic hearing that the Bay bridge had fallen, and the City was on fire . . . it took me nearly an hour to get to my infant son (only a few miles away) because the traffic lights were out , and 3-4 hours to get up the mountain (near the epic center) to my preschooler (bridges out, landslides, traffic) . . . where I met up with my EX, he wanted to go back to Santa Cruz, fearing the stability of the house, but the last I saw of Santa Cruz it was billowing in smoke and flames . . . All in all we fared well (1 broke window, all the crystal and china), lost three weeks of work, but we survived better than our neighbors because we had just bought groceries, had 200 gallons of storage water and backpacking supplies . . . but for 2-3 weeks the roads were destroyed, the gas stations were closed, the grocery store were smashed, the banks and atms were down, and there was little or no utilities and phone . . . we had no way to let people know were OK . . . I beleive attitude and metal preparedness is key to these situations.

posted in Preemptive Postapocalypticism - 0 replies

Global Warming and/or the next Ice Age

Kate — Sun, 25 May 2008 23:34:08 GMT

A thread on our tribe has been debating whether or not global warming is a real phenomenon. Its good to think critically, to avoid just jumping on and telling our weather stories--I've got a few from this Spring alone. I didn't mean don't tell the stories, I love to hear them, its exciting and I can relate. But the folks who think we're just having fun or just spooked need to get their heads out of the sand, or out of wherever they are, and look at the science.

Now that I said "science" I'm going to advise a book that is while based on science, also highly entertaining. Really exciting to read. And every phenomenon described in the book can be researched by finding it on NASA.

I'm all for having some fun. Much can be learned from fiction. Its more understandable. And then, go for it. Check it out. Say, "Is this possible? Likely? and go look it up on a reliable scientific site. Here is a great review of the book I'm recommending:

http://www.epinions.com/content_315526188676 First paragraph, " Global warming to many just means that the earth is getting warmer due to trapped greenhouse gases and a shrinking ozone layer in our atmosphere. Big deal, right? Nobody likes too much cold anyway! Well, global warming, is a very big deal. So big in fact that the United Nations has recently released its report on global warming. Long before the UN's report, however, these authors looked at global warming and published this book, which helps explain global warming's causes, impact, and one frightening but convincingly possible scenario: A New Ice Age!"

Have fun.

posted in Preemptive Postapocalypticism - 17 replies

Permaculture video, perfect for the homestead.

Tinkles — Thu, 29 May 2008 05:17:33 GMT

http://video.stumbleupon.com/#p=495ntje2mt

Lemme know :)

posted in Preemptive Postapocalypticism - 1 reply

Setting everything else aside...

A Thousand Good Intentions — Sat, 24 May 2008 03:49:45 GMT

Setting all prejudices and predispositions aside, what do you think is the most ideal place to set up a permanent survivalist retreat?

Taking into account

Government and permit restrictions

Seismic activity

Abundance of wildlife

Remoteness from others

Low priority ground-zero targets or none at all

No downwinder effect

Volcanic danger

Cost of living

Climate

Anything else I forgot

If you had the whole country to pick from, and nothing to stop you or make it difficult for you to move there or set up there.... What state or what region of that state is the most ideal that you've encountered?

Just curious

posted in Preemptive Postapocalypticism - 10 replies

Because I like beating dead horses

A Thousand Good Intentions — Wed, 07 May 2008 05:24:43 GMT

http://www.newsmax.com/newsfront/NASA_Climate_cooling/2008/05/01/92541.html

No such thing as global warming. In fact, NASA meteorologists predict a 30 year 'mini ice-age' coming soon, and several long, harsh winters. This has nothing to do with greenhouse gasses or anything manmade, it is a natural cycle having to do with solar intensity patterns and how they affect 'el nino' and 'la nina' and deep oceanic currents.

I still have never, to this day, been presented with conclusive, science-based evidence that global warming is caused by humans or even related or influenced by humans... Now, even the existence of global warming is in jeapordy of becoming proven 100% WRONG... Not even partially right, not even 'a close projection, the outcome being slighly off from what we originally thought'

No. Leftist Whackos predicted global warming. The earth is entering a cooling stage. They could not be farther from the truth, they could not possibly be MORE wrong. if they were any further wrong, they'd be swinging back closer to right. Read it and weep. Or read it and laugh, depending on what banner you've been under the past ten years.

posted in Preemptive Postapocalypticism - 33 replies

My morning papers

A Thousand Good Intentions — Wed, 21 May 2008 03:17:46 GMT

http://www.survivalblog.com/

I read it every morning during the slow, boring times at work. Nothing earth-shattering on the site, but a lot of useful links and it's updated several times a day, news tidbits and editorials that cater to the survivalists in the world.

Every now and then there are some really cool accounts by people living in various collapsed or collapsing societies in the world.

Bookmark it, you just may find you enjoy it with coffee more than the local newspaper.

posted in Preemptive Postapocalypticism - 5 replies

burning man type vs survivalist type

raswpynuggets — Sun, 17 Feb 2008 23:30:03 GMT

ok im going to rattle some cages here but i hear alot of BM types talking in alot of the same subjects as survivalists. any thoughts on this? art car vs mad max? the playa vs barter town?

posted in Preemptive Postapocalypticism - 143 replies

Why am I beating this dead horse?

A Thousand Good Intentions — Wed, 07 May 2008 05:32:31 GMT

http://www.cnn.com/2007/WORLD/americas/11/08/brazil.oil.ap/index.html

New oil field discovered off the coast of Brazil. Untouched, full to overflowing, instantly bringing the country of brazil from nothing, to one of the top ten oil producing countries of the world.

Peak oil....

More like peak gullibility! Pay attention to how far down this oil is, as noted in the article. How far out from the coast. And realize that with all the environmental restrtictions on oil exploration, and past limitations on our drilling technology... All the oil we've ever discovered or explored for, All the oil consumed in the history of mankind, resides on less than 20 % of the earth's surface. Just imagine how much more is out there. Just look at what is becoming available with our new technological exploration and drilling capabilities.

posted in Preemptive Postapocalypticism - 42 replies

Your 10-Most-Important-Items -To-Bug-Out-With List

Horse — Thu, 03 Apr 2008 04:05:29 GMT

It's TEOTWAWKI, and you have 1 hour to gather the 10 most important survival items you will need in the coming year. You don't know where you'll end up tomorrow or the day after, but you know you'll be surviving any way you can. Anyone? Fire when ready...

posted in Preemptive Postapocalypticism - 26 replies

You folks should enjoy this Pandemic story...

bad-dawg — Mon, 05 May 2008 16:15:14 GMT

http://www.signonsandiego.com/news/health/20080504-2101-pandemic-rationingcare.html

I found it interesting, if somewhat conservative...

posted in Preemptive Postapocalypticism - 5 replies

processing the entire animal

Brent — Tue, 22 Apr 2008 21:47:44 GMT

Ok Paige, How do you make the gut's and brain's, lip's and A-hole's taste like the hot dog's at baseball field. Or anyone else that might have the same library as the survival mamma.

posted in Preemptive Postapocalypticism - 50 replies

Hi, Hello, and Howareya

Saltheart — Tue, 29 Apr 2008 15:28:01 GMT

Just joind this tribe, gonna check the backlog of post and I'll post more as I see threads that interest me. I'm in New Orleans, 48 male, dazzeling brite, handsome, witty, intelligent.....wait, wait....sorry that's not me....8-)

posted in Preemptive Postapocalypticism - 6 replies

storing grain in barrel's

Brent — Fri, 25 Apr 2008 16:16:28 GMT

What I plan to do this spring is after the wheat harvest when the grain elevator's have had time to dry the wheat to about 11% moisture, I'm going to go buy a couple of thousand pound's. just have them run it out in the back of my pick-up then scoop shovel it into barrel's in my basement. The dried grain cost a little more per bushel than out of the field.

I alway's get mixed up on the amount of pound's that make a bushel but I think it's 60 pound's of wheat per bushel. Then they factor in the moisture too. So say dried wheat is 7 dollar's a bushel you can do the math on how much you can store. 35 buck's put's up alot of bread. I may do the same thing with rice this fall.

So even if you live in the city, it may be worth a drive out to the country if you can locate your closest grain buyer's.

posted in Preemptive Postapocalypticism - 9 replies

Natural barriers

sharkgoddess — Thu, 06 Mar 2008 18:12:07 GMT

After perusing the marauding thread, it got me thinking about how to use landscaping and terrain as part of protecting your home. How building on a hill or in a valley changes very much how you'd build and protect your home.

When I had a suburban backyard a few years back, the neighborhood thugs thought that it would make a nice walking path to get from one block to the next, so I cultivated nettles, thistles, barberry, caneberries, and all manner of unpleasant vegetation along the fencelines. Between that and the dog and the random covered holes that I dug along where they were walking, they decided to go elsewhere.

So, natural barriers? Plants and terrain as part of your home protection system? Thoughts?

posted in Preemptive Postapocalypticism - 24 replies

How to Disappear

A Thousand Good Intentions — Wed, 19 Mar 2008 02:01:33 GMT

Prepaid cellphone, cash-only account, in a false name... Check.

Unlicenced, unregistered, contract-free rental arrangement and do not recieve mail at this address.... Check.

Driver's license, vehicle registrations, and tax info all going to a P.O. box in a remote town I only visit a couple times a year.... Check.

I'm curious about how to dissappear. How about handling money transactions that must be non-cash? internet purchases and the like? Remember, I prefer not to have a bank account in my name, and a bank account NOT in my name would be fraudulent in ways that can get a person in trouble. Having a cellphone in a false name is like ordering a pizza with a false name... no big deal. But I don't mess with banking under federal protection, with fraud.

Any other ideas that are easy to do and still allow a person to have a pretty normal existence in society?

posted in Preemptive Postapocalypticism - 32 replies

Preparing for the current world food/oil shortage

Horse — Fri, 25 Apr 2008 02:03:51 GMT

Hi folks! I think we're in for a rough ride for at least the next year or two, with regards to the current worldwide food/oil crunch. Honestly, it seems like things are getting bad quickly for much of the world, and may get worse. To that end, I thought maybe we could start a discussion/list of general advice/resource listings/links to help each other prepare. I will start with this -

Here are 2 links to free downloadable books:

numerous medical books available at Hesperian: http://www.hesperian.org/publications_download.php

a wide variety of military manuals available on the downloads page at: http://pamedia.com/phpNuke/index.php

Some good stuff here!

posted in Preemptive Postapocalypticism - 19 replies

The Alaska Experiment

Brent — Tue, 22 Apr 2008 23:29:32 GMT

There's a new show coming on discovery channel tonight that look's like it might be pretty good. It's called the alaska experiment, about 4 group's of ordinary people dropped in the wildneress to live off the land. It comes on a 9 central time.

posted in Preemptive Postapocalypticism - 13 replies

famine in US?

Brent — Tue, 22 Apr 2008 01:33:58 GMT

Is it my imagination or am I hearing rumor's of food shortages and nation wide famine? If so I don't understand why. Just a reminder that a 20x20 garden plot can make alot of potato's and tomato's. Do you guy's have one planted? I know Chuck does. Even if your renting you might get by with having a few heavy egg laying chicken's.

Does anybody have any info on the food shortage rumor?

posted in Preemptive Postapocalypticism - 29 replies

Has anyone noticed how seriously sick people are getting?

Earthdancer — Sun, 20 Apr 2008 12:20:38 GMT

I think the super bugs are upon us!!!

posted in Preemptive Postapocalypticism - 13 replies

invester survivalist

Brent — Sun, 30 Mar 2008 07:03:18 GMT

Since the dollar value has plunged downward, all the money type rich folk's, like thor, are not investing in i-pods and computer's right now. They've been investing in thing's like food and farming. fertilizer companies and any product that has to do with farming or groceries in general. If you would have bought pot ash (fertilizer, not the hippy dope) a couple of month's ago you would have doubled your money by now. Not to mention oil. I think it could be a sign of hard time's the way people are trying to secure their money in the thing's we need the most and not the blackberry companies and nike tennis shoe's. I've even heard there's been alot of investing in ammo.

I'm no stock market wizard but I was wondering what you guy's thought about it.

posted in Preemptive Postapocalypticism - 19 replies

A year of food storage

A Thousand Good Intentions — Tue, 15 Apr 2008 02:51:36 GMT

Enter the number of people in your family... This software has it all broken down into the most affordable, basic staples that still supply your dietary and full nutritional needs for a year's food supply for each person. Saves a lot of scratch-paper work, and even if you're not into wheat, it gives you a really good idea, a baseline of what you are lookin' at in terms of a full year's food supply per family member.

http://lds.about.com/library/bl/faq/blcalculator.htm

Go on.... Enter a number at the top. It's neat.

posted in Preemptive Postapocalypticism - 15 replies

28 days later: How are you equipped?

Mitch — Wed, 16 Apr 2008 03:55:22 GMT

Here is the scenario: The 28 days syndrome just started in your city (as in the movieplotline) It started in the night so you and yorn were safely at home in your fortress.

So, you wake up in the morning with people running batshit everywhichway in the streets. With only what you currently have (at the time you are reading this thread) how equipped would you be to survive the first 28 days? Tell us about your strengths and weaknesses. Mitch the EOW predator would not be a problem for the first 30 days or so (He'd be be too damn busy with his own zombies.)

posted in Preemptive Postapocalypticism - 10 replies

PETA... SHMETA

A Thousand Good Intentions — Mon, 08 Oct 2007 20:06:06 GMT

I just got a new pet. I picked him up for free at one of my customer's homes the other day, they had a litter and were getting rid of them. As it turns out, this guy is a great EOW sidekick and I reccommend one for any survivalist. It's a potbelly pig!

He's housetrained, affectionate, clean, and cute. great at foraging, he can sniff out a bag of food under two feet of dirt. He's alert to danger at all times, AND as a final perk, I'm sure he would taste really good if the food storage ran out! hehehe....

right now he's only about thirty pounds of pork and the rough 'stature size' of a twelve pound dog, but he'll add on over time, and his expiration date isn't for another fifteen years or so. No more are the days of outdoor livestock, just waiting for looters or poachers to come when I'm sleeping or not available to protect what's mine. My christmas ham takes naps safely by the fireplace...

now the question is, what do I name my little friendly slab of bacon? hahaha

posted in Preemptive Postapocalypticism - 68 replies

DIY food preservation

A Thousand Good Intentions — Fri, 18 Apr 2008 03:23:42 GMT

What are your preferred methods for:

Fruit?

Meat?

Veggies?

And all the other sub-categories. I'm really interested in low-tech food preservation this year. Especially the kind of low-tech that is still easy to do post-eow. Here's (yet another) thread for Paige to really shine I'm sure... but ALL info is very appreciated, and will most likely be experimented with if I think it's viable for me this growing/harvest season. Let's hear them!

posted in Preemptive Postapocalypticism - 12 replies

Map of safe zones in the World?

Stuart — Sun, 10 Feb 2008 19:51:13 GMT

Does anyone have a map showing which areas of the Earth will be safe and which ones will be dangerous. I know that you need to be away from the coast, fault line and volcano. You also need to be away from huge population centres. Does anyone have specific places on a map to live?

posted in Preemptive Postapocalypticism - 22 replies

How I spent Friday evening: Or, should I shoot the bastard?

bad-dawg — Tue, 08 Apr 2008 00:01:41 GMT

OK, this is a true story, and it happened to me, last Friday.

I drove 25 miles to my home on the edge of the city we call San Diego. I live in an unincorprated area that is a mixture of old houses, tract homes, sleazy apartments and ranches of 1 acre and up. It's rural town-land with egg ranches, dairies, and equestrian centers with other stuff, and right up against the mountains. I am right in the center of this "town" area. It's a little on the tough side, known for Hells angels, Tweekers and skinheads in our county.

As I getting out of my car, which I park on a spot that is on my property, but on the edge of the street. What do I hear? Breaking glass! I look over and there is this "punk kid" breaking bottles in the street, right across from me.

I say " Hey! Please don't do that! Somebody's going to have to clean it up! The punk drops his bottles and trucks on over to where I am unloading stuff from the car and challenges me with a "what the fuck are you going to do about it, Ese? Fuck you you pussy!" So I'm Like Ok, That's not what I expected, and realizing he's not a kid at all but a Vato with prison tats all over him. So I say to him calm down pal I'm not dising you, just asking you to stop throwing your trash where I live. He goes on with "Well I know where you live fucker and you messed with the wrong guy and I'm going to fuck you up and burn your house!" That was too much. I am unarmed and getting pissed now and I tell him. So you are going to threaten me and my family? You just need to get out of here now. And he comes back with "Pussy and something like Get on your knees and beg me to leave"

OK, now I'm done. I tell him where he can stick it and he takes a swing at my face, and connects with my right eye. and then jumps back about 6 feet. It's glancing but I am wearing glasses so I get them knocked off my face and broken and get what turns out to be 3 cuts from the frame. SNAP! The switch in the back of my head clicks and I go into action. I jump forward and come down on him like a load of bricks, pop him really hard on the temple with my right fist, knock him to the pavement trip and fall on top of him. While I'm there, I slam his head on the pavement a few rimes and knee him in the kidney. I then roll off the top and jump up onto my feet. Mr. Vato is lying in his blood, shakes his head, looks at me and says "Why you do me like that?" So I start yelling Get up you asshole You threaten me in front of my house and you expect me to roll over? I'm going to kill you!!!

Fortunately (for him) all of my skinhead neighbors and the good ones from across the street are out there by now and keep me from killing him. They separate us and the punk goes into a tirade about how he is going to kill me, my family, my dogs... Burn the house down, Etc. The skinheads are telling him to get out of here (Because they don't want the sheriff to interfere with their meth sales) My buddy Gary says go back to your place and we will get the punk to leave. Anyhow the punk won't leave and he keeps screaming and follows me back to the house with I know where you live and I am going to be back which I respond to with Go right ahead and come on in, I have a lot of buckshot for you, pick up my cell and call the Sheriff. As soon as I do that, Mr. Vato Takes off. About 3 minutes later The deputies show up, I give them a description and they go looking. He's gone though...

So know I am left with a Punk Chicano gang banger, Obvious Ex-con that has threatened My life, my7 families life, and my property, in front of 10 or 12 witnesses and the sheriff says "sorry, nothing we can do".

Maybe he won't come back. I beat him down bad, he is going to have scars and definitely knows I won't back down and won't be pushed. And I have very watchful neighbors. I am a little sore as he did get one elbow into my ribs, skinned myself on the pavement, split my left thumb punching him, and tore the tendons in my right elbow beating him like he deserved...

So who thinks I have the right to shoot his ass if he is on my property? Outside, I mean. Of course I have the right if he breaks in, but I don't want him past my driveway. What would you have done differently?

Discuss?

posted in Preemptive Postapocalypticism - 27 replies

With freakin' lasers on their heads!!!

A Thousand Good Intentions — Sun, 13 Apr 2008 04:28:43 GMT

Robot quadrupeds, capable of fully autonomous terrain navigation while carrying a 350 lbs payload of weapons and armor:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=W1czBcnX1Ww

Robot avians, capable of hours of sustained flight, and carrying multiple air-to-surface and air-to-air short range rockets:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2grd9RVS1Ek

Track-mounted ground based machine gun toting robots, capable of covering miles of flat urban terrain in a hurry

http://www.nationaldefensemagazine.org/issues/2007/September/Gun-Toting.htm

Remember, it's just a short-leap of adding two-plus-two, to outfit these buggers with facial recognizers like we use in surveillance systems... A short leap of logic to wrap them in lightweight nanotube carbon-fiber laminate that would stop a .44 mag point-blank. A couple advances in alternate energy away from outfitting them with methane fuel cells to keep them whisper-silent, emission-free, and mobile for months on end... We have digital olfactory sensors that put a bloodhound to shame... Infrared cameras. night-vision. Hearing amplifiers. seismic sensors in the feet. Sonar. Radar.

And don't forget and NEVER underestimate the capability of perfect, synchronized hive-mind logic, all units acting in concert and delivering real-time communication to each other. If one sees you, they have instantly all seen you and mapped your position and heading on their GPS.

This is more of a 'for fun' posting. I would'nt go so far off the fringe as to seriously entertain the idea of hundreds of 'big dog' drones patrolling the forests, backed by predator air-support while child-sized miniature track-vehicles patrol the streets of my hometown mounted with belt-fed SAWs (or low-energy, silent, lightweight compressed laser pulse emitters) and motion-tracking infrared cameras.

I mean, it's not like all the electronics for this crap comes from China or anything. And I'm sure American military is the only one who has thought of engineering or employing anything even REMOTELY autonomous and robotic for the purpose of killing other human beings.

It's so creepy that it's kinda fun to chew on the idea for a while. Mull it over during breakfast tomorrow.

posted in Preemptive Postapocalypticism - 16 replies

If You can help

Curtiss — Sat, 12 Apr 2008 17:26:23 GMT

read this post
http://tribes.tribe.net/backyardgardensurvivalists/thread/9b310749-16e1-4628-abc4-a16faff3e635
It isn't easy asking for help but I thought I'd test if a virtual community had some concrete azpects of community in it. I humbly ask your pardon and your help.

posted in Preemptive Postapocalypticism - 3 replies

Levels of force in a survival situation

A Thousand Good Intentions — Mon, 07 Apr 2008 01:02:07 GMT

Some people may have contemplated the use of deadly force in self defense in a post-EOW situation... Some scenarios are pretty black-and-white, others are a little more grey... for example, do you use deadly force to defend your crops against refugees and scavengers? What if they are children? Do you use deadly force when someone refuses to leave until you offer them some of your food?

What if there is NOT a total lack of civil order? what if there is martial accountability for you if you are to use deadly force, but perhaps civil disorder is bad enough to where you definitely need to defend your life or livelihood against looters and vandals?

They say when the only tool you have is a hammer, every problem starts to look like a nail. I think when it comes to active defense, many survivalists are relying on only one tool, with a trigger and a barrel.

What are your thoughts on less-than-lethal weapons like tasers, bird-bombs, OC pepper spray, perhaps even zip-ties, cuffs, or other restraining/detainment devices as part of your survival armament? Do you keep those items in your arsenal? do you feel a person should keep them?

posted in Preemptive Postapocalypticism - 12 replies

Gun Choices

A Thousand Good Intentions — Fri, 07 Mar 2008 05:46:47 GMT

Some opinuendo about gun selection:

Many people, when looking for a good bug-out or post-societal survival implement, often look to military performance as the gold standard of survival. I'd like to point something out:

Military performance deals in a world of cost bidding, mass manufacture, and within parameters of 'acceptable losses' when they tally up the score on their guns. They are dealing with an assumed user of highly trained nature, in a world of volume numbers, group fighting tactics, and a whole logistical train of support.

Is that the kind of parameters you think your post-apocalyptic survival will be based on? Which one of your kids would make a suitable 'decoy' to draw out a sniper while you look for his position? Is your spouse an acceptable loss? Do you plan on swapping out parts and ammo with twenty other fighters in your group? Just how do you plan on hauling around enough bullets to support the rate of fire for your weapons to perform within their expected parameters of combat hits-and-misses?

I wonder if a different group might be a BETTER model to look at... Say, maybe the pioneers, the frontiersmen, the trappers and settlers? People who had to live low-tech, make low-tech repairs, needed diehard reliability, NOBODY in their group was an acceptable loss. Indian raids, robbers, injustice outside of the reach of the law... Guns that needed to be pressed into service for hunting as well as defense as well as transportability.

Instead of asking yourself 'what would rambo pick for his survival arsenal'....maybe we should be looking at the array of today's weapons technologies and asking ourselves, 'what would Daniel Boone or Jim Bridger take with them to the wilderness?'

Just a thought.

posted in Preemptive Postapocalypticism - 51 replies

Concentration camps? here?

A Thousand Good Intentions — Mon, 17 Mar 2008 06:53:59 GMT

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0P-hvPJPTi4&feature=related

Is this a bunch of clever editing? Is it a hoax? Is it paranoia? I sure hope so. Somebody debunk this one for me please. I found several of these videos from different locations stateside.

Some people say the government is getting ready for massive dissent when the american continent gets unionized and later joined with europe. Most people say that's a load of bollocks, spun up by fantasy-survivalist-militant types.

I used to think the unionizing of america with canada and mexico was just all that 'New World Order' conspiracy crap for the insane and the paranoid delusionists...

then I read this... http://www.worldnetdaily.com/index.php?fa=PAGE.view&pageId=57228 (basically, our right OF the people to alter, or to abolish our government, should it alienate our fundamental rights, has officially been undermined, circumvented. We are now preemptively being regulated by armies and governments over which we as people have no right and no control. No representation and no rights against foreign armies, and our own military will not only refuse to stand for our defense, they will welcome and cooperate with foreign forces... A veritable "sheeple-beatdown exchange program.") and a few other contextual items have caught my attention as well. Now I'm really questioning and searching into it.

I started out coming across some scary stuff a few weeks ago, about the economy crashing (and holy cow, it is crashing) about the elections, about all this stuff... I researched deeper into it, to try to find the hoax, the gaps in logic, the weak paranoia that is usually easy to dispell, disregard, and keep on living in my secure world of 'hypothetical preparation', knowing full well that the baloon might not go up at all, or at least not in my lifetime, or at least not within the decade. I kept finding more substantiation for all of it. Someone, tell me I'm crazy, and point me to a source that proves this is all fake bollocks.

posted in Preemptive Postapocalypticism - 104 replies

Decisions you would have to make

Mitch — Sun, 06 Apr 2008 06:12:35 GMT

A catastrophic event was going to happen in just a few days. It would destroy world economy and level your country to the bronze age. Knowing this there would be several decisions a president would have to make;

What do you do with your prisons? Do you round up the prisoners and have them stand at ground zero or just leave the system to break down and the prisoners to get loose into the world? Do you have the national guard clean out the prisons?

Do you pull out your border patrol and reassign them to internal duties? Is a border really that important when there's a mile high tidal wave washing up on San Diego and splashing all the way to Yuma?

Would any of your allies use the event as cover to launch preemptive strikes, strikes designed to leave you blind so they can invade following the event.

posted in Preemptive Postapocalypticism - 0 replies

That old can of worms...

A Thousand Good Intentions — Thu, 20 Mar 2008 20:26:33 GMT

okay okay sorry in advance. Give me five seconds to put the flame-suit on after you read this little bit about recent scientific breakthroughs in global warming. Big scientific research program to finally PROVE gobal warming to be true... has discovered that the earth is actually cooling? well, they call it 'less rapid warming' when the temperature drops steadily over a period of several years.... Enjoy:

Some 3,000 scientific robots that are plying the ocean have sent home a puzzling message. These diving instruments suggest that the oceans have not warmed up at all over the past four or five years. That could mean global warming has taken a breather. Or it could mean scientists aren't quite understanding what their robots are telling them.

... but wait, there's more ...

"There has been a very slight cooling, but not anything really significant," Willis says. So the buildup of heat on Earth may be on a brief hiatus. "Global warming doesn't mean every year will be warmer than the last. And it may be that we are in a period of less rapid warming."
The hypothesis must be right. There's something wrong with the instruments!
It's also possible that some of the heat has gone even deeper into the ocean, he says. Or it's possible that scientists need to correct for some other feature of the planet they don't know about. It's an exciting time, though, with all this new data about global sea temperature, sea level and other features of climate."

All of it which inconveniently contradicts their central paradigm. Good luck with all that.

Here's the whole article http://www.npr.org/templates/story/story.php?storyId=88520025 , I wish Thor was around to see it.

posted in Preemptive Postapocalypticism - 14 replies

Not off the grid/city survival (and intro!)

em* — Sat, 08 Mar 2008 18:42:09 GMT

Blessings everyone!
I'm tired of lurking so I thought I'd post an intro AND a question at the same time?
My husband and I both relocated here a few months ago, to an apartment near the city (so we're IN the city, but not IN the city, if that makes sense) We both are former military (USMC) as well.
At this point, we're starting from ground zero regarding ANY survival preparations.
If you lived in a SMALL (read: 6 unit) apartment complex, have a tiny patio (but are willing to plant on it) and two bedrooms, what steps would you start taking to prepare yourself from the impending shitstorm?

blessings,
em*

posted in Preemptive Postapocalypticism - 9 replies

Why McCain is a criminal and not after your best interests...

bad-dawg — Tue, 18 Mar 2008 20:27:22 GMT

Now... I'm not saying vote for anyone else... Just read everything you can and make an informed decision...

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Keating_Five

http://www.slate.com/id/1004633/

http://www.nytimes.com/2008/02/21/us/politics/21mccain.html?hp

http://www.sptimes.com/2008/02/28/Opinion/McCain_s_situational_.shtml (from George F. Will)

http://news.aol.com/elections-blog/2007/07/12/now-mccain-has-ethics-problems/

posted in Preemptive Postapocalypticism - 5 replies

rocket stove questions

msdynomite — Thu, 06 Mar 2008 23:29:03 GMT

I'm feeling totally googled out right now, so I'm putting the questions to y'all. I posted this on Survivalists, but I think everyone's over here right now so I'm cross-posting. :)

Chuck turned me on to zzzip stoves/sierra stoves: http://www.zzstove.com/sierra.html
which then lead me to their source, the rocket stove. I found this cool site which sells small ones made of recycled cans: http://rocketstoves.org/

1) building a small rocket stove
that second link has a video on how to make a large one (see link at bottom of page), but I'm looking for something like the size shown in the pic or the size of a sierra stove. I have a bunch of 28oz tomatoe cans, plus smaller bean and tomatoe paste cans. I figure I must be able to make one for backpack/emergency size, but can't find directions for something that small. Anyone got links or instructions?

2) buying a rocket stove
it seems all the rocket stoves are the same price: $40, whether they're the sierra brand, or the recycled ones, or the gas powered MSR Pocket. so I'm wondering what you think -- is the brand name (first link) better, or would that recycled one (second link) be just as good. I like the idea of one made out of cans, but the two are constructed so differently I'm wondering if this may be a case where battery powered and new might make a difference.

posted in Preemptive Postapocalypticism - 5 replies

My friend has a question

A Thousand Good Intentions — Wed, 12 Mar 2008 20:50:44 GMT

Wasn't sure if I should post this in the gunversation tribe, or this one? I flipped a coin, here we are.

So I have this friend. And he doesn't like the idea that some of his guns are registered. He was wondering, is there an easy way to get those reccords disconnected to his ownership of the guns? Maybe file a 'stolen gun' report with the police? I mean, guns get reported stolen all the time. Sometimes, it might turn out that your cousin borrowed it and didn't tell you, and you get it back a few months later. You might neglect to tell the cops that you found your gun again.

What should I tell my friend? Too risky? Would it violate some seriously bad laws? what do you think?

posted in Preemptive Postapocalypticism - 12 replies

Dream bunker, anyone? Pick a model and have it installed.

A Thousand Good Intentions — Tue, 26 Feb 2008 07:29:17 GMT

The most complete, -and completely awesome- "any and EVERY type of emergency" shelter building company I've seen so far. These guys have been doing it over 20 years, and they pretty much have all the kinks worked out.

http://www.disastershelters.net/index.php

posted in Preemptive Postapocalypticism - 27 replies

Refilling the med kit

sharkgoddess — Sat, 15 Mar 2008 18:47:14 GMT

I was shopping around for some refills and found this site, the prices seemed good, especially on things like electrolyte tabs and pain relievers. I'll probably place an order, I need more ibuprofen packs.

http://www.first-aid-product.com/

posted in Preemptive Postapocalypticism - 3 replies

Apparently they are either lying or they aren't as smart as a 5th grader.

Curtiss — Thu, 22 Nov 2007 21:59:52 GMT

The "climate scientists" ignore the fact that the Sun has entered a period of greater activity. What pray tell were you taught in elementary school was the primary source of heat and light on Earth? Why do you think these "climate scientists" ignore something every 5th grader knows? Could it be a political or financial agenda perhaps?

posted in Preemptive Postapocalypticism - 171 replies

Dutch ovens

Brent — Fri, 29 Feb 2008 23:09:51 GMT

Do any of ya'll here do any dutch oven cooking? Anytime we're on a canoe trip where we have a base camp we take a dutch oven. You can cook anything from a whole chicken to a pizza in them. I think having a dutch oven or 2 handy in a post EOW.

posted in Preemptive Postapocalypticism - 20 replies

Traps and Snares

A Thousand Good Intentions — Mon, 11 Feb 2008 03:57:40 GMT

Post-apocaliptively speaking, most people if not nearly all, are going to have hunt for meat, to some degree at some point. Depending on the circumstances, guns might not be the best tool for the job anymore. Ammunition might be better reserved for zombies or just wearing on belts to look cool... Shots can expose location, which could be a bad thing in certain scenarios. Shots can also ruin meat, if you bring a deer rifle and all you find for the day are squirrels.

I'm not experienced with snares and traps, in practical application. I know how to make a wire snare, I know the mechanics of several types of deadfalls, etc. And I know, that with the right tools and the proper knowledge, a person can quietly and safely harvest much more food with traps than with guns.

Has anyone here had experience using snares? how about commercially available 'cam lock' snares, etc? What are the best snares out there, to get as preparation? Any snaring/trapping experiences to share?

posted in Preemptive Postapocalypticism - 19 replies

Fresh Water Springs in the desert...

sturmeyarcher — Thu, 28 Feb 2008 19:26:23 GMT

I like exploring the Oregon desert. Though the western half of Oregon resembles a rainforest for much of the year, the largest portion of the state, which lies east of the Cascade Range rain barrier, is semi-arid.
When I look at USGS topographical maps, I see lots of springs listed.

My question is, is there some reference guide that describes these springs in any detail?

I'm curious about information like flow rate (whether it is more like a "seep", or if water flows away from the spring in a channel), whether the spring is seasonal, etc.

posted in Preemptive Postapocalypticism - 27 replies

New Moderator

inspeyere — Thu, 06 Mar 2008 17:09:58 GMT

I for one welcome our new well intentioned overlord, and as a trusted internet personality I could be useful in helping round up the survivors to toil in his 'most dangerous game' land with looting enthusiasts and anal fetishists like Mr. Cool Ice.

posted in Preemptive Postapocalypticism - 4 replies

So I watched "Ever Since the World Ended"

Curtiss — Sun, 02 Mar 2008 23:52:38 GMT

I guess the other post has dropped off; but because of that post I check Netflix and they had the DVD so I put it in my queue. Watched it Thursday night. Freaked me out a little that Adam Savage from MythBusters was in it. I find it hard to believe that 12 years after the plague that wipes out 99% of humanity that cigarettes that were made before the plague are still worth smoking. I don't smoke, never have;but family members do and did and stale tobacco is terrible by their accounts, I think the scene where they are shot at in the Mountains north of San Francisco was pretty well done but I don't think someone would just open up on people in the words without a word of warning. Especially in an area that the guy that got shot was so familiar with. I also thought it was odd that so many of the survivors were hippy like Californians that no longer had a problem with guns, hunting and eating meat. Although I thought it obvious that the guys that wrote the script had no idea what kind of game was available in Northern California. There are Mountain Lions in Pacifica within sight of downtown San Francisco.I don't think San Francisco would be the best place to stay after the fall of civilization what with the likelihood of earthquakes and the availability of better farmland within a days walk of the Dumbarton bridge. The land both north of and south of Sanfracisco is better for farming, large scale gardening. Overall I thought it was interesting to see someone else's idea of what postapocalyptic life will be like.

posted in Preemptive Postapocalypticism - 15 replies

moderator: revisited

msdynomite — Fri, 29 Feb 2008 17:40:41 GMT

ok, it has now come to my attention WHY a moderator is needed for this tribe. there are certain tasks a moderator can perform, like, i dunno, say blocking members who exhibit inappropriate behavior. so I'd like to suggest that we cut the BS of the namby pamby nominations of the past and just resolve to have a mod today.

anyone second that motion?

list your top 3 choices for moderation now. you can list yourself.

posted in Preemptive Postapocalypticism - 27 replies

DIY Medicine tribe

Sentience — Wed, 27 Feb 2008 10:06:45 GMT

Check it out. The focus is on natural medicine but includes anything that might be available for self care.

http://tribes.tribe.net/diymedicine

posted in Preemptive Postapocalypticism - 0 replies

The world is snuffed out; these people are in same shelter what would happen, would they last one year ? go on have a look

squirrelization — Wed, 16 Jan 2008 18:18:55 GMT

verminator,brent,malcious,paige, 1000good intent's,Chad,old tree,Adam and unsu

myself cannot be there BEcause I live in Australia

posted in Preemptive Postapocalypticism - 33 replies

What are you doing to prevent a collapse?

A Thousand Good Intentions — Mon, 25 Feb 2008 06:09:52 GMT

Sometimes I get jaded with the way this country is evolving. Maybe I have an over-idealized image of the 'way things used to be'. I don't know, I was never there. But I imagine a better America than what we have today.

We all watch the Decline, wringing our hands, maybe wagging fingers at our opposing political adherents, shaking our heads in resignation. Like people on a sinking ship, 'tsssk tsssking' all the holes we find in the hull. Who is picking up a bucket and pitching in to help?

I had some thoughts, I wrote em down. When I was done, I thought I might share them with you. So here's a wall of text for you to mull over if you have the attention span for it. Let me know what it makes you think.

"The Way Things Used to Be"

For one, it annoys me that they're raising the minimum wage. (I believe in a free market, not this socialist 'government salary allotment'. But that's another can of worms) And it pisses me off that nearly every american market is inflating at reccord rates. The cost (and quality) of manufacture vs. the large profit margins have never in history been more disparate. A dollar used to mean something. A nickel used to buy something. How high can prices go before a dollar flies around like a mexican peso? In the end, the escalating race between ridiculous prices and raising wages and salaries will devalue our overall economy. One day, it will take fifty dollars to buy an hour of a man's labor, and thirty dollars to buy a gallon of milk. Will a dollar be worth the paper it's printed on? or will we have to switch over to completely electronic moneys, they way we lost our silver and gold coin and traded it for paper bills back in the day?... I hunt for bargains as much as I can. Not so much to save money, but because I try to resist buying into the mentality that dollars are becoming worthless and it takes twenty times more of them to be worth the same ammount of goods they were worth half a century ago.

I'm also jaded about the paranoid distrust in our society. You can't get a phone line or an apartment or a job anymore without the same level of background checks it takes to purchase a rocket launcher. Everyone assumes that everyone else is a liar, a thief, a violent person, a drug user.. until that other person jumps through enough hoops, tests, forms, and checks to prove otherwise. I also resist this trend as much as I can. I talk to an employer and secure a job BEFORE I fill out any paper work or applications. I refuse to work for anyone who dictates otherwise. I look pretty hard to find landlords I can work a deal with on the honor system. No contracts, no deposits, just honest agreements and communication between us. So far, I haven't been burned, nor have I burned anyone else.

Kinda like the guy who recycles all his trash in an effort to 'save the world'... I know my efforts are useless, in the grand scheme of things they won't make a difference. It just makes me feel better about myself to try to do what I can, to keep trust between strangers, and keep value in a dollar. I imagine there was a lot more of that 'the way things used to be'.

posted in Preemptive Postapocalypticism - 2 replies

frugal people make good apoc planners

msdynomite — Wed, 06 Feb 2008 04:50:19 GMT

found this site from Life Hacker today. Looks like it would be a helpful resource for emergency/survival prep. It offers solutions for homemade options to cleaning product and cosmetics, ways to make a small amount of money last, where to find free or beneficial supply sources.
http://frugalvillage.com/

posted in Preemptive Postapocalypticism - 10 replies

I Got What America Needs Right Here

inspeyere — Thu, 14 Feb 2008 07:12:42 GMT

For all you pinko survivalists: http://www.theonion.com/content/opinion/i_got_what_america_needs_right

posted in Preemptive Postapocalypticism - 5 replies

America != World

Mon, 10 Dec 2007 20:23:19 GMT

For those of you who are not familiar with C-style relational operators, != means "not equal to".

Even though America likes to be in charge all over the place, it seems to shock people that America is not, in fact, the be-all, end-all of existence. I find this is often especially true with middle-class Christians, whom I have a great deal of experience being around because I am one. A lot of times, you can't toss the idea out there that America is heading down the tubes without the other party conjuring images of Jesus coming through the clouds because the whole shebang is over at that point.

I think for sake of simplicity, we often refer to it as "end of the world" scenarios, but most of our discussion really centers around the end of America as we know it. I'm sure that anyone living in a relatively stable nation views their surroundings as some kind of litmus test for the health of the whole world, but I think we can agree that despite the global marketplace that exists today, the rest of the world would continue to function without this country's involvement (some would argue that they would function better).

There seems to be a strong stigma ingrained into the minds of nearly anyone I talk to that the decline of America is just not possible. I'd wager the Babylonians, Assyrians, Egyptians, Aztecs, Greeks, and Romans all felt the same way until it happened. I think that the trend of associating the world with your particular country may be a big factor in why people can't seem to wrap their heads around the prospect of something like this happening... in their minds it is much more epic than it really is. Which is more catastrophic-- a collective national identity dissolving, or a meteor ripping through the planet? Obviously the physical destruction is a lot more noteworthy than ideological, but my impression is that the two notions are inexorably tied within the minds of many people. Yes, a nation collapsing will cause turmoil and probably quite a bit of death, but it isn't going to sweep across the globe like some kind of super-plague. People will still survive-- existing nations will hobble along, and new nations will eventually rise. The same thing has repeated itself countless times throughout history, and I think it's silly to assume that because we have cell phones, automobiles, and fixed-interest mortgages that the collapse of THIS country will be the "big one" that ends it all.

posted in Preemptive Postapocalypticism - 59 replies

are now the end times...are you ready?

Briggi — Fri, 08 Feb 2008 04:38:29 GMT

I have my post-apocalyptic act together. Ever since I was a kid back in the '50s, nurtured on movie and book fiction about how it would be after the big atomic war that would destroy everything. I used to love that stuff and there was alot of it during the coldwar time. Now the sci-fi movies and books talk more about world-wide eco/bio -disaster triggering end-all. Whatever the case, I have my swiss army knife, my leatherman knife, a roll of duct tape, a package of rubber bands, and some paperclips. I'm ready. I'm ready to head for the hills when the time comes. In fact I'm already there.

Has anyone read any of these really great post-apocalyptic stories?:

* Shikasta* by Doris Lessing 1979 ... In spite of the best efforts of Pleiadians and Sirius, Earth people self-destruct,... but find they have powers they'd forgotten about.
* Last Refuge* by Elisabeth Ann Scarborough 1992 ...Surviving within a bomb shelter in Tibet is an unhappy woman, whose baby has been fathered by Cliff, a bad ex-CIA agent who is actually her own father....and somehow responsible for ...
* False Dawn* by Chelsea Quinn Yarbro 1978 ...that lab virus got out of control and killed damn near everybody. Land pirates in methane -powered vans terrorize survivors. .. but now people are able to regenerate missing body parts.

And I guess eveyone has seen

* Waterworld* starring Kevin Costner
* Mad Max* in three different movies, starring Mel Gibson

Do you have any fave books or movies on the topic?

Somehow I'm looking foirward to the end of a de-humanizing, demeaning, debilitating civilization, that only gets more repressive, suppressive,oppressive with each passing day. It seems that the more population grows, the more social controls are enacted, and the less free, funky, natural it gets. All I can say is "Screw You, 4 horsemen,... and the 2012 you rode in on... Bring it up, I'm ready!... Are YOU ready?"

dream on yall... and dream with me.
b!

posted in Preemptive Postapocalypticism - 1 reply

Autonomous resources for your bugout location

A Thousand Good Intentions — Sat, 26 Jan 2008 04:40:19 GMT

Let's say you have a bug out location up in the hills. A 5 to 20 acre, isolated patch of land. No utilities, maybe a stream or you have a well or spring. You want to set it up preemptively post-apocalyptic. What are some useful self-regulating resources you could set up and leave for the most part unattended or lightly attended, and be reasonably sure that they would do well and be there for use when you bug out? Beehives come to mind, wax is one of the most useful of natural substances for utility and medicine, and honey is an obvious value as well. Bees are great for keeping Chad away.

But what else? what kind of systems could you set up for keeping different kinds of wildlife in the area? (no mechanical feeders-too high maintenance, think natural) what kinds of animals would you keep? what are some vegetables or useful plants that you can propagate and then let them go wild in a mountainous environment for food... potatoes? berries? what else?

posted in Preemptive Postapocalypticism - 15 replies

a backup resource for Preemptive Postapocalypticism

msdynomite — Thu, 22 Nov 2007 00:55:05 GMT

Since Tribe has been having difficulties I realized it would suck to lose good places like this and the people in them. So I got proactive and made a "backup" site called Tribe Refugees, which includes some discussion groups to parallel favorite tribes.

I've created a Survivalism Group as part of the larger Tribe Refugees network. You can use the site as a place to:
- chat during the donut times
- "backup" your Tribe contacts
- retreat to should Tribe just finally kick it

You need to first signup for the site (Tribe Refugees), then join the Group (Survivalism -- which is just a matter of clicking the Join Now link).
Survivalism: http://triberefugees.ning.com/group/survivalism
Tribe Refugees: http://triberefugees.ning.com/

If you'd like more information about the Tribe Refugees site:
How to Join: http://triberefugees.ning.com/forum/topic/show?id=1400844%3ATopic%3A25
About the Site: http://triberefugees.ning.com/forum/topic/show?id=1400844%3ATopic%3A4901
Similarities between Ning and Tribe: http://triberefugees.ning.com/forum/topic/show?id=1400844%3ATopic%3A6716

Please note: the site/group was intended to support this tribe, NOT compete or detract from it. I just thought you guys might like to know about it so you can bookmark it, or signup to squat your space, or go ahead and participate. :)

posted in Preemptive Postapocalypticism - 5 replies

"A message from the Presindent."

Michael — Tue, 29 Jan 2008 05:02:53 GMT

"A message from the Presindent."

The very word "secrecy" is repugnant in a free and open society, and we are a people inherently and historically opposed to secret societies, to secret oaths and secret proceedings. For we are opposed around the world by a monolithic and ruthless consperacy that relies primarily on covet means for expanding its sphere of influence. Infiltration rather then invasion, subversion rather then elections, intimidation rather then free choice. It is a system that has conscripted vast human and material resources into the building of a vast tightly knit highly efficent machine that combines military, diplomatic, intelligence, economic, scientific, and political opperations. Its preperations are concealed not published, its mistakes buried not head lined, its dessenters silenced not praised, no expenditure is questioned, no secret revealed. That is why the Athenian law makers decreed it a crime for any citizen to shrink from controversy. I am asking your help with the tremendous task of alerting and informing the American people, confindent that with your help man will be what he was born to be, free and independent!

JFK

posted in Preemptive Postapocalypticism - 2 replies